I'm planning a new build. This will be my first build from scratch, my current PC is a pre-built I got in 2010, with a few upgrades. I only intend to upgrade once, so i'm trying to perfect this as much as possible before purchasing anything. I'm open to ideas or suggestions to improve it without significantly ballooning the budget. I have been reading reviews for a lot of the parts I've considered. And I've been trying to keep my budget around $2200 (tax would add roughly another $180). I'm making this to play at 1440p 144Hz, preferably with G-sync/Freesync. 4K 144Hz wont be out for a while longer (I'm assuming), and when it is out, it'll be first gen and way too expensive. 1440p144 will be a big upgrade from 1080p60. I intend to overclock both the CPU and GPU. https://pcpartpicker.com/list/zpxzgL Manual prices are Microcenter prices. CPU: AMD Ryzen 1700X - $270 MC has a special offer (For 1700X and 1800X) now that saves you $100 when getting a CPU/Mobo bundle. The Ryzen 1700 bundle only saves you $50. This essentially makes the Ryzen 1700 and 1700X the same price, so I opted for 1700X. One of the staff members at MC said the 1700X comes with a stock cooler (I'm assuming its the Wraith Max). I've searched online a bit and some people said they've managed to OC to 3.7/3.8 while maintaining under 70 Celsius with the stock cooler. If temps are too high when I attempt an OC, then I will look to get a 240mm AIO water cooler. Given the bundle, Intel (i.e 7700k) would be more expensive and it wouldn't be much better, if at all. Ryzen also seems to have much smoother gameplay than Intel CPUs. Mobo: Asrock Fatal1ty AB350 Gaming K4 - $105 Went with this one because MC has it and its cheap. Read some reviews about it on Newegg and it doesn't seem that bad. Choosing the Mobo was probably the hardest to pick. I'd honestly prefer an M-atx board but there arent many good options, especially at MC. I know its not the best option but other mobos cost significantly more. MC has an open-box Asus ROG Crosshair 6 hero at $195 x2, MSI Pro Carbon at $143, and Gigabyte Aorus Gaming 5 at $145. But I'm not sure if the bundle offer would still apply to open box mobos. If bundle applies to Open-box Mobos, which one should I pick? http://www.microcenter.com/product/476088/ROG_CROSSHAIR_VI_HERO_X370_AM4_ATX_AMD_Motherboard http://www.microcenter.com/product/476043/X370_Gaming_Pro_Carbon_AM4_ATX_AMD_Motherboard http://www.microcenter.com/product/476020/AORUS_GA-AX370-Gaming_5_AM4_ATX_AMD_Motherboard RAM: G.Skill Trident Z 16Gb (2X8) DDR4-3600 - $190 I picked this one primarily because it is said to be Samsung B-Die Ram. B-Die ram is said to be much better at achieving 3200Mhz+ speeds with Ryzen, and only B-die ram has been able to do 3600Mhz. And I picked high speeds because Ryzen has been proven to perform better with faster Ram. Storage: Sandisk Ultra II 480GB SSD - $150 I would've preferred the 850 Evo, but its $180+. According to the specs, this Sandisk SSD is very close to the 850 Evo. MC says they can match the prices, so I will try getting it there first before going online. PSU: EVGA Supernova P2 850W Platinum - $130-150 MC rep suggested the 750W version, but the 850W is only an extra $7 in online pricing. I will try to get MC to match this price as well, but I dont know if they match mail-in rebates (meaning, would they match $130 or $150?) Case: Corsair Carbide Series Spec-02 - $58 Cheap case, has future expand-ability for 240mm (for AIO water coolers) at the front, 120mm at the back, and fits some 240mm at the top depending on mobo and ram height, according to a YT review. OS: Windows 10 - $80 I have a laptop with Windows 10, and dont like it. Current PC is windows 7, and I never used that free windows 10 upgrade. Dont know if its possible to get W10 free through upgrade, but on the new SSD. GPU: Gigabyte GTX 1080 Ti 11GB Aorus - $715 There's 2 Aorus (This one and Aorus Xtreme Edition) cards and from what I've seen the only difference between them are stock clocks and maybe the warranty. I've seen some reviews and it seems that the Zotac AMP extreme and the Aorus are the best of the bunch, but I chose this one because its cheaper (AMP extreme is $760) and Gigabyte is a bigger brand. Would choose factory water cooled card at similar prices (Seahawk, Hybrid, or Gigabyte Water force) if they existed. I know EVGA sells the hybrid coolers for $170, but you have to apply it yourself. This most likely voids warranty, and its only for the reference models. Which leads to my next part of the build that is linked to the GPU choice. Monitor: Dell S2716DG 27" 2560x1440 144Hz G-Sync - $500 http://www.microcenter.com/product/458837/S2716DG_27_LED_G-Sync_Gaming_Monitor Its the cheapest I can find for G-sync 1440p144. There were some 165Hz monitors for same price, but were 23.8". My biggest question is, when will AMD's Vega GPU come out? And will they have any GPU on par (or better/close to it) with the 1080Ti? I'd imagine the AMD version would be cheaper, and If i got AMD then I can completely change my monitor choice to this http://www.microcenter.com/product/450964/MG279Q_27_LED_Gaming_FreeSync_Monitor Asus 27" 1440p 144Hz free-sync IPS for $530. Basically I get an IPS monitor for an extra $30 over the G-sync variant. I would not mind waiting a month or two for AMD's vega if it turns out as good. The other option is to get the free-sync IPS monitor and 1080Ti anyway, but look to sidegrade or upgrade (Via selling used 1080Ti) to AMD in the future if there's little cost. Thanks for reading this far. Sorry if this is long but this is a big investment for me and I want to make sure I make this right. So thoughts? changes or suggestions?
You should go with a good motherboard like the Crosshair 6 because it will be one of the first to get bios updates later on when the new Ryzen+ CPUs come out that will let you do a nice CPU upgrade without changing your motherboard. I do like ASRock as a brand, they can make some good boards, but the lower end chipset lines are usually trashy from ASRock. Basically you are looking for something with an X370 chipset rather than a B or A series chipset. Everything else looks good. Sounds like you know what you want and know your hardware. I think an 8 core 16 thread CPU is a great choice, as games will start to support high core counts more and more. We are already seeing where 6+ cores are necessary in games like Battlefield 1 if you want to push 144fps. AMD's Vega GPUs are launching next month, but from the look of the specs it wont be better than a GTX 1080 (non-ti). Once again AMD fails to put enough rendering backend on their cards and goes way overboard on the shader power. They finally have a decent number of texture units, so AF quality wont impact games even a little with the combo of TMUs and shader cores, but it just wont have the raw pixel crunching power you really want for high framerate and/or high resolutions.
@EniGmA1987 Thanks for the reply. The motherboard is still the one im mostly undecided on mainly due to price. A new Asus C6H ($245) would add $140 to the budget, which is why I'm considering Open-box motherboards. The Gigabyte Aorus AX370 Gaming 5 https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128992&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker, LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID= is the one im leaning towards for Open-box since its $146, but im not entirely sure if its worth it. Its X370 chipset and still has a ton of features. The Open-box Aorus board would only add $40, and since both the board and GPU are Aorus, they'd color match. The MSI Pro Carbon is getting much better reviews on Newegg though. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813144017&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-PCPartPicker, LLC-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID= and the Open-box MSI pro carbon is $143 at microcenter. Are those 2 in similar quality as the Asus C6H? EDIT: I've sent an email to a microcenter staff member asking about these 3 Open-box motherboards. Mainly asked about condition, if they were display models or returned (and why), and if they apply for the Save $100 bundle. Once I get word back from him, I should have a better picture of which mobo to go with.
Id steer clear of any MSI board. Their marketing VRM has always been trash and that board looks to be about the same. They also have the worst bios I have ever used. The Gigabyte Gaming 5 would be a fine choice.
Well looks like imma have to make some changes. Went to MC to check on that open box motherboard and it turns out its missing the socket bracket (so it cant mount a cooler) and they dont have replacement parts. I'm considering getting the Asus Crosshair 6 mobo, but Ill probably have to change the monitor. Still the Asus MG279Q, but refurbished. https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824236665&ignorebbr=1 Its $100 cheaper than the brand new version. Would refurbished be worth the risk? I'm concerned it'll have dead pixels or backlight bleed.
So I set everything up now. 1700X Overclock to 3.85Ghz at 1.4v. I had it stable higher in previous bios 1107 for Asus C6H. I could probably lower volts a bit while maintaining same clocks but haven't tested it extensively yet. The problem at the moment is ram. No matter what frequency I chose, it would always be 2133Mhz after booting until It finally settled on 2667Mhz. Today with Asus Bios update 1201 I was able to push it to 2933Mhz. There's supposed to be a new update sometime soon (AMD AGESA 1006) that will bring further support for ram kits. And it turned out the CPU didn't come with a cooler (only 1700 comes with one) so I had to buy a Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo. Its a tower cooler and it barely touches the side panel window. If new update wont increase Ram speeds, I'm considering returning the mobo, CPU, and/or cooler for either another 1700/1700x and different brand mobo. I still have another week to return mobo and CPU. I could probably save $80-120 returning these 3 components in favor of cheaper mobo and the 1700 with stock cooler.
I havent looked extensively into clocking the RAM on the new AM4 socket processors, but I have seen people say 3200MHz is achievable on the C6H pretty easily with Samsung B-Die memory with the right settings. Try checking around one of these subforums for the info on how to do that: http://www.overclock.net/f/13/amd-general http://www.overclock.net/f/10/amd-cpus http://www.overclock.net/f/11/amd-motherboards That new AGESA code is supposed to make things easier as you said, but it may change how some things "work" so just be aware that once it comes out there may be a few days as the community sorts itself out and finds the new best settings to use for fast memory speeds. From the few minutes I just took to read a little on the settings to use, it looks like you need to set PCI-E to gen 3, increase the SoC voltage to 1.2v, and bump the memory voltage to 1.4v. This seems to let people run at DDR-3200 with 14-14-14 1T timings on good memory sticks. I also found one of the best threads here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1628751/official-amd-ryzen-ddr4-24-7-memory-stability-thread (just be aware Silent Scone the thread author is a complete dick so dont get offended when he talks down to you, he does it to everyone) And be sure and check out this guide: http://www.mediafire.com/file/mciue95x0a2xfq7/C6H+XOC+Guide+v05.pdf ASUS always puts out some of the best RAM tuning guides for their top end boards. And if you need help, Raja who works at ASUS is usually pretty available and really knows his stuff.
Today I was actually able to hit 3602Mhz through D.O.C.P. 1 (2933 Strap) and BCLK at around 122.8. The only problem now is that my CPU OC doesn't seem stable. Tried 3200 yesterday but it didn't work. I tried running Prime95 at 3.84Ghz and 1.4V but It stopped running on its own after a minute and I get a "Execution Halted" on the text. I used HWinfo64 to monitor it while it runs and I could see how cores/threads would just drop down to 0% usage until only 1-3 threads were working. Looked on google a bit and read that if P95 stop working on its own, its because of lack of voltage. bumped voltage to 1.4125 and tried testing again. Right now im 25 minutes into P95 and only 7/16 threads are working. the other 9 are at 0%. temps has been 71c max. 3.85Ghz (1.4v) and 2667Mhz (1.35v) ran stable before and at 65c. I also read that there's some silicon lottery when it comes to the IMC chip (that comes inside the CPU) that determines ram OCs.
High memory stress most definitely can lower overall core clock speed. Though it also could be that your memory is somewhat unstable too, and when a value gets corrupted and a core tries to use that info it will result in a calculation error and Prime will stop. So it could be either thing. Try bumping your memory voltage another .025v and see if you gain more stability in Prime or not. That may give you a clue to where to start tweaking again. Great job running stress tests at 3.6GHz mem clock though, that is really impressive.
Tried up to 1.45v on memory voltage and it ended up worse. 4 minutes in and only 2/16 threads were being used. Tried cpu voltage at 1.45v and it worked better with 15/16 threads at full usage. The 1 thread that wasn't at full was 4th thread that hovered between 6%-30% pretty early. I'm not comfortable running 1.45v (or more) on CPU (Its the max recommend for 24/7 usage) since idk what effects it will have on longevity. EDIT: I forgot to mention, When I load Prime95, it says its optimized for AMD Bulldozer. idk if this affects it or not. I cant seem to find a stable OC with 3200 or 3600Mhz via BCLK. and 3200 without BCLK boots up at 2133. I suppose ill have to stick with 3.85Ghz at 1.4v and 2933Mhz (14-14-14-14-34). I already tested these speeds and played like 6 hours of Ghost Recon: Wildlands without issues.
Prime95 is an extremely hard stress test, one of the hardest. And it stresses an area not regularly used by many applications or games. Most people now days dont even bother with being Prime stable as most think it is an unrealistic goal to achieve. I always strive for prime stable, as well as being stable in all other areas as some games I play are extremely taxing on the CPU. But for most people, if you can pass 8-10 hours straight of Asus' RealBench, as well as do about 10 hours of x264 encoding without a failure then it is deemed stable enough for everyday use. x264 stress test: https://mega.nz/#!ywAFDQQQ!hEQCeRXDKpHoeRYEaspux3ZA9Smx6tp8h0leb7ZHdJo Use 16 thread option for this test and set it to run something like 100 loops. RealBench: http://dlcdnmkt.asus.com/rog/RealBench_v2.54.zip And I often like to do some y-cruncher runs to test when using huge chunks of memory: http://www.numberworld.org/y-cruncher/#Download
Seems that x264 test isn't supported on windows 10. It just runs some video from a movie, 2 kids hiding under a chimney. Anyway, I went in today to change the exchange the mobo and CPU. Got the Asrock x370 Taichi and another 1700x. and $70 back (CPU price went down another $20, mobo went down $5) Had no problems booting ram 2933. 3200 wouldn't boot. Cpu is a problem though. Its running way too hot. 3.85Ghz at 1.25v ran 68c in less than minute on P95, before eventually crashing in 2nd minute due to temps (over 74c limit) same speeds but 1.35v apparently ran 4 minutes and 62c, still crashed later though around 8th minute and went up to 80c, idk how it didn't crash before that, but I stopped the test due to temps. I applied thermal paste 3 different times to make sure that wasn't the problem but it kept running hot anyway. The hyper 212 evo is a pain to install/uninstall. I have to remove the ram and gpu and have someone else hold the cooler while I tighten the bracket clamps. One of the heat pipes also extends a little higher than usual and makes constant contact with my sidepanel window. I'm thinking of returning the tower cooler, exchanging the CPU again, and getting a Cooler Master MasterLiquid 240 liquid cpu cooler for $90.
Got a new 1700x and the cooler master liquid 240mm. So far I have 3.9Ghz at 1.4v. Ran prime 95 for an hour and a half and got 78c max, 68c average. Then I ran Unigine Superposition (I know its not cpu based) on 1080P Extreme (35.3 min fps, 43.5 avg fps) settings and got 52c max. Ran Superposition again but at 720p low and got 54c max (98.3 MIN FPS, 154.4 AVG FPS) And it turns out I was reading the temperatures wrong on HWinfo64. I was reading the motherboard cpu temps rather than the cpu sensor's temps. And the cpu sensor gives 2 temps. CPU (Tctl): (X +20) CPU (Tdie): X (basically the real temp numbers without the 20c offset that AMD put in) I know the Cpu can go higher. I was able to do boot and complete Cinebench R15 at 4Gh and 1.43v with 66c max. but these settings crash on prime 95 due to temps, as it goes past 82c before crashing. Atleast I determined a stable baseline now. I still have quite a bit more to tweak, and ill be trying some OCs (for ram) through the Ryzen Master software as I've heard that some folks can get 3200Mhz that way. And then also some BCLK OCs to see if ram can go any further. And im gonna implement some Ghost Recon: Wildlands gameplay for testing. Then there's the new upcoming AGESA update to look forward to. My advice to anyone getting Ryzen 7 CPUs, if you expect good OCs (anything higher than 3.7Ghz), get a good cooler. The first CPU could've probably been good had I had this 240mm water cooler to begin with. EDIT: After some extensive tweaking and testing, I was able to get 3.9Ghz stable at 1.35v Cinebench 62.5c max, and Prime 95 got 72c max at 42 minutes of blend test. Ill be doing a longer prime95 test when I have time but it looks stable. I also got it stable at 1.344v, but for some reason temps on P95 went up to 81c at the 46 minute mark, (which is why ill retest 1.35v later), It didn't crash though. Temps are quite a bit lower than 1.4v in comparison. (66c vs 62.5, 78c vs 72c) I was also told that the water pumps are designed to run full speed 24/7. I dont know how true that is, but looking around on google, it does seem that full speed is the recommend speed (and also in DC mode, not PWM). I had pump in standard mode for all of the testing, so temps should be a little lower with pump at full. Ill test higher ram and cpu clocks tomorrow, but 3.9Ghz is pretty good already.
Article on the new AGESA code: https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/amd_details_their_new_ryzen_agesa_1_0_0_6_update/1 Looks like the beta bios with this code is already available for the Crosshair 6. ASUS is usually the best at getting support out the fastest. Hopefully the Tachi will get it sooner rather than later.
Yup I saw that, it came out literally a couple hours after I exchanged my C6H for the Taichi But a new beta bios came out for the Taichi yesterday. https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/6dl8iv/taichi_beta_bios_1006_agesa/ I haven't updated yet though, I'm wondering how safe beta bios' are. Edit: Did the update and it seems 3200Mhz (14-14-14-14-34) is working stable. Tried 3466 and 3600 but it wont boot yet. 3333Mhz boots up (sort of) passes some tests, but its a little weird. When I start PC with 3333Mhz, it turns on, "crashes" for a second (all mobo lights turn off, fan stop spinning), and then it turns back on again. Sometimes it will repeat that crash and turning back on cycle 2 or 3 times before finally booting to windows. And after applying the 3333Mhz settings, I boot up, then restart PC and go back to Bios, the Bios reads ram speeds at 2133, but then it'll show 3333 when using HWinfo64. None of these issues happened with 3200 thus far. I'm expecting better ram speeds after the official bios version is released.
3200 @ 14-14-14 is pretty good. If you can maintain that with 1T command rate then your latency will most likely be the best with those settings than with anything higher.